The bulk update request #4230 has been rejected.

create alias vtuber (5055) -> virtual_youtuber (0)
create alias vtuber_persona (0) -> virtual_youtuber (0)
create implication nijisanji (564) -> virtual_youtuber (0)

Reason: Making Nijisanji match Hololive's implication, and uniting the various vtuber tags under the unabbreviated term.

EDIT: The bulk update request #4230 (forum #358401) has been rejected by @furrypickle.

They should alias vtuber, since not all vtubers are on youtube (and we don't need to distinguish virtual youtuber specifically from other platforms).

watsit said:
They should alias vtuber, since not all vtubers are on youtube (and we don't need to distinguish virtual youtuber specifically from other platforms).

There's no term to distinguish from platform to platform. They're all virtual youtubers. Some of them are on Twitch, but they don't call themselves 'virtual twitchers' or 'virtual streamers' although I like the ring of that latter one.

Vtuber is an abbreviation for virtual youtuber, so if your concern is that points to a certain platform, aliasing them to vtuber instead of virtual youtuber won't solve it. It would be better to alias them all to virtual_avatar for what they're worth.

wolfmanfur said:
There's no term to distinguish from platform to platform. They're all virtual youtubers. Some of them are on Twitch, but they don't call themselves 'virtual twitchers' or 'virtual streamers' although I like the ring of that latter one.

Youtube is a specific platform. A youtuber is a person who makes content on/for youtube. A virtual youtuber is a youtuber who uses a virtual avatar. Some vtubers are on youtube, some on twitch, some on piczel, and who knows how many other video services there are. Not all of them are streamers. Vtuber is the generic term for someone who makes online video content using a virtual avatar, regardless of platform and whether it's streaming or VODs.

wolfmanfur said:
Vtuber is an abbreviation for virtual youtuber

And youtube is an abbreviation for You Tube, where "tube" is an old term for a television (which were largely CRT at the time, which stands for Cathode Ray Tube). We can go back as far as you want on the etymology of these words, but as it is, Youtube is specifically the Google-owned video site, and Youtuber is someone who makes video content on/for Youtube. Unless you want to argue the term Youtube has been genericided and refers to any online video platform, we should avoid "youtuber" for an online video creator (whether it's on or off youtube) as much as we avoid the term photoshopped for edited images (whether it was made with Photoshop or not).

watsit said:
Youtube is a specific platform. A youtuber is a person who makes content on/for youtube. A virtual youtuber is a youtuber who uses a virtual avatar. Some vtubers are on youtube, some on twitch, some on piczel, and who knows how many other video services there are. Not all of them are streamers. Vtuber is the generic term for someone who makes online video content using a virtual avatar, regardless of platform and whether it's streaming or VODs.

And youtube is an abbreviation for You Tube, where "tube" is an old term for a television (which were largely CRT at the time, which stands for Cathode Ray Tube). We can go back as far as you want on the etymology of these words, but as it is, Youtube is specifically the Google-owned video site, and Youtuber is someone who makes video content on/for Youtube. Unless you want to argue the term Youtube has been genericided and refers to any online video platform, we should avoid "youtuber" for an online video creator (whether it's on or off youtube) as much as we avoid the term photoshopped for edited images (whether it was made with Photoshop or not).

I really don't care either way, I just think it's silly to argue about this bur, especially using this argument, only because virtual youtuber has 'youtuber' in it meanwhile vtuber is ironically an abbreviation for the term. Both virtual youtuber and vtuber are used generically, arguably vtuber more often because folks are lazy it's an abbreviation. If you don't want the reference to youtube, I reckon aliasing to virtual_avatar would be generally much better anyway, especially given the fact that the 'metaverse' is a thing we'll be hearing more often someday.

'Yt' is the abbreviated form of youtube, 'You Tube' is a different way the site was spelt 2 decades ago, but that's besides the point. As for the photoshop example, it's just wrong, somewhat. Photoshopped was aliased to 'shopped' which effectively means the same thing, they removed the 5 first letters of the word and called it a day. It could have been aliased to photo_manipulation or edit, but nope.

wolfmanfur said:
I really don't care either way, I just think it's silly to argue about this bur

This isn't the first time it's come up

wolfmanfur said:
only because virtual youtuber has 'youtuber' in it meanwhile vtuber is ironically an abbreviation for the term.

Either way, "Youtube" is a specific online video platform, and the shortening of "virtual youtuber" to "vtuber" removes the association to it.

wolfmanfur said:
If you don't want the reference to youtube, I reckon aliasing to virtual_avatar would be generally much better anyway, especially given the fact that the 'metaverse' is a thing we'll be hearing more often someday.

That may be a little too generic, as then any fursona or personal character could count. But I would certainly prefer that over 'virtual_youtuber'.

wolfmanfur said:
'Yt' is the abbreviated form of youtube, 'You Tube' is a different way the site was spelt 2 decades ago

I meant the word "youtube" was created as a portmanteau of the words "you" "tube", denoting a site were every day people ("you") could publish and watch videos like on television ("tube"). Either way, the point is that a word can take on a different meaning from its constituent components. Sure, "vtuber" may have been created as a contraction of "virtual youtuber", but it's distinct enough in its own right to have taken on a different meaning (one more generic and not associated with Youtube). Same as "shopped" is a shortened form of the word photoshopped, removing the association with Photoshop, as it's more generic and used with non-Photoshop edits.

wolfmanfur said:
As for the photoshop example, it's just wrong, somewhat. Photoshopped was aliased to 'shopped' which effectively means the same thing, they removed the 5 first letters of the word and called it a day.

For the same reason (why else change it at all? why not alias "shopped" to "photoshopped"?). Photoshop is a specific art program, and photoshopped came about as a term to indicate an image was edited with Photoshop. Over time, people started to use the term more generically, with people often meaning an image was just edited with anything. But Photoshop (much like Youtube) is a trademarked name denoting a product or service from a specific company. Because people were using it generically and putting the word Photoshop at risk of being genericided (genericized?), put out a press release telling people to not say "The image was photoshopped." but instead say "The image was enhanced using Adobe® Photoshop® software." Using the term "shopped" instead of "photoshopped" has the same effect of removing the trademarked name for things not associated with the Photoshop trademark, as using the term "vtuber" instead of "virtual_youtuber" does for things not associated with the Youtube trademark.

The term "vtuber" is already genericized beyond repair, and it's not as though it's a mystery where the shortening even comes from. It's only the corpos who care, and even in the case of Nijisanji which uses Youtube instead of Twitch, they still have their own corpo-speak word for their talents. It is incredibly silly to try and preserve YouTube's trademark on their behalf.

We don't use moving staircase for escalator.
We don't use rebound tumbler for trampoline.
We don't use waste container for dumpster.
We don't use spinning toy for yo-yo.
In fact, band-aid has aliases where the common trademarked term is preferred over the unwieldy "generic" term.

Literally just start there. "Vtuber sees more consistent use outside of e6, here's proof (link to Google stats), alias to that instead." Jesus.

lafcadio said:
The term "vtuber" is already genericized beyond repair

Vtuber is not a trademark, unlike Youtube.

lafcadio said:
We don't use moving staircase for escalator.
We don't use rebound tumbler for trampoline.
We don't use waste container for dumpster.
We don't use spinning toy for yo-yo.
In fact, band-aid has aliases where the common trademarked term is preferred over the unwieldy "generic" term.

Terms that have well been genericized. Which, unless you want to claim Youtube has been genericized, is not the same thing.

lafcadio said:
Literally just start there. "Vtuber sees more consistent use, alias to that instead." Jesus.

I can't show that. I mean, I can show a vtuber referring to themselves as a vtuber instead of a virtual youtuber, and I can show vtuber is a common term in the community, but I can't run a poll among them all to know which term is used more consistently. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't, I can only say it makes more logical sense to use vtuber here, and gave my reasons. See topic #33730 that tried to alias vtuber -> virtual_youtuber which was rejected, topic #29201 that's also trying to alias vtuber -> virtual_youtuber and is still pending (with a nijisanji implication too), and topic #33051 that is trying to alias virtual_youtuber -> vtuber and is also still pending, waiting on an unalias request for hololive -> virtual_youtuber in the same thread for it to work. There've been a bunch of other requests for these tags, and it's all a mess that I wish could get cleaned up because more BURs that may or may not need the alias flipped or implication targets changed will just keep getting made.

lafcadio said:
The bulk update request #4230 has been rejected.

create alias vtuber (5055) -> virtual_youtuber (0)
create alias vtuber_persona (0) -> virtual_youtuber (0)
create implication nijisanji (564) -> virtual_youtuber (0)

Reason: Making Nijisanji match Hololive's implication, and uniting the various vtuber tags under the unabbreviated term.

"Virtual Youtuber" is where the portmanteau originates, but Vtuber is the better term:

• Vtuber is the accepted industry term, both Nijisanji and Hololive use the term officially
• Inaccurate, many vtubers stream on platforms like Twitch or even Picarto
• Not a popular term among fans of Vtubers, or Vtubers themselves, nobody refers to themselves as virtual_youtuber
• It's just a clunky tag name

It's like insisting on "iPod Broadcasting" instead of "Podcasting", it's inaccurate and nobody uses the term.

The bulk update request #4230 (forum #358401) has been rejected by @furrypickle.