Topic: Looking For Advice For A Friend

So I have a friend who recently made content for D&D 5E and posted it on DMsGuild. A race supplement.

Sadly, said friend (and me, or I'd help him) is incredibly low income and thus had to use AI placeholder art in order to have a feature-complete PDF he could post.
He refused to post it artless, stating that it would not be feature complete.

Now, the description lists the AI art in it and says it's placeholder until he can afford an artist. He's not hiding that he used AI. Hell, it lists that it has AI placeholder art before it lists the key features, just to be as transparent as possible.
At which point he will remove all AI art, replace with real art, and update the PDF for all buyers.

The only problem being that r/unearthedarcana & r/DnDNext & r/DnD do not allow AI art...so he can't really advertise it to a large audience.
I can see that it's frustrating him: If he did not add art, then it would have never been up for sale. But in adding placeholder art so that he could sell it, he cannot advertise it TO sell it and thus cannot afford to replace the art!

Basically, he's said he feels like it was now wasted effort & doomed to die regardless of all the effort he put in in the past 3 months to make something he was proud of selling (Remember; He's selling the race supplement, not the art. He's in no way claimed the art or hid that it's both AI and a placeholder). Just because he can't afford to hire a real artist from the start.

I'm hurting for him, and I can't figure out what to say or do to help.
He's already posted it to r/DmsGuild to a whopping 1.7k views! ...And 0 feedback or sales... Think about that; 1.7 thousand people on REDDIT looked at his post and did not say a word, positive or negative.

I know he had further ideas, but he told me there's 0 point, as he can't afford an artist, which means using placeholder art, which means no sales, which means no affording an artist...

Does anyone have any advice? :(

There are many ways to go about it, provided you have the commitment.

• Earn some actual money through hardwork and jobs to pay for an artist for art.
• Learn to make art, either you or your friend.
• Try to get a sponsor or ask for donations.

fuzzy_kobold said...

I did some digging on the r/dmsguild subreddit & found a few posts that have some advice from people within the community, & some with resources to find cheap/free non-AI art. I assume you/your friend is familiar with these, but I figured there's no harm in bringing them up in case I'm wrong.

• This post is about someone in a similar situation that did get some responses.
• https://www.reddit.com/r/dmsguild/comments/1m7ebur/art_options_nonai/
• https://www.reddit.com/r/dmsguild/comments/1m606fx/use_of_ai_art_on_dmsguild/
• https://www.reddit.com/r/dmsguild/comments/1kvr4xv/how_accepted_is_ai_art_in_free_products_on/

As for new suggestions as they move forwards, keeping some kind of social media dev log might be a good idea, as it:

• Allows you to build an audience before release
• Provides a record of your efforts (this help the creator mentally as well; it's easier to be confident in your work when you have a record of what it took to get there)
• Can allow prospective customers to build an emotional connection to the project (both in-universe - in terms of its content - & on a meta level - in the project & its creator's success)
• Can provide useful feedback for what the potential audience finds compelling, allowing the creator to better focus their efforts
• Allows the user to market themselves instead of solely relying on the project itself
• The amount of licensed media corroborates that people will be influenced to pick media not just for its inherent qualities, but also its external relations
• Think about how many fewer people would have cared about Starfield & Cyberpunk 2077 on launch if they weren't invested in their creators already?
• You can see how well this worked for Rollerdrome & No Man's Sky (though the initial product left much to be desired in that case); I'd link the Internet Historian vid, but... not really looking to promote their work anymore

And you get those benefits for free! It sucks that you can't just put good stuff out their & let it thrive on its own, but there's a lot you can do to market your product without relying on some publisher/marketer, a fat stack of money (whether it comes from crowdfunding or not), or sacrificing significant time/effort that could have otherwise gone into making the thing itself.

I will note that this tactic is mainly used by indie games (although it's so effective it's basically a requirement); you can't consume a game's content by reading it, so it's a bit harder to work with in this context, but I'd say it still has great potential. There's a lot of value in presenting the process & content of a project as a series of small, intimate, accessible bites that leave people hungry for more. After all, the entire idea of commercials is to give the audience an impression of the thing being sold, & for entertainment media, this is frequently done using small snippets of the work itself.

I hope things get better for them fwiw; it's always disheartening to feel your efforts have been wasted, especially when it's through no fault of your own.

thegreatwolfgang said:
There are many ways to go about it, provided you have the commitment.

• Earn some actual money through hardwork and jobs to pay for an artist for art.

Gods, both of us would kill (not literally) for jobs.
But we live in a rural area with no public transportation. We're both disabled, but disability loves finding new and exciting ways to cut benefits.

thegreatwolfgang said:

• Learn to make art, either you or your friend.

I've been trying for years, but part of my disability is an inability to hold drawing/writing implements properly.
I also think I can't mentally picture things in my head? It's hard to explain but in the Before Years, some decades ago, art class was my worst class; I could never think of anything to make, nor envision anything to make it in any medium. Be it wood shop, clay, drawing, or painting.
I think it's called aphantasia?

I'll pass this idea on to him. I don't know why he has not learned to draw.

thegreatwolfgang said:

• Try to get a sponsor or ask for donations.

I'll pass this on as well. Though asking for donations feels...icky?
We talked about it before he gave up in a spot of bleak depression, but asking for money to pay someone to help him sell a thing feels...Wrong.
Like 'Please give him money so he can sell something & make more money' feels, in a way, dishonest.

Thank you for the interest and suggestions!

If they don't need a product 'right now' they could always put it on the back burner
to drum up more funds passively. putting aside a set amount of savings
from any sort of income they receive, Dood.

(Laying off the fun stuff will suck but if you really want it, ya know, Dood?)

Also in the meantime they could:
Practice their drawing skills if they are capable like TheGreatWolfgang said
while looking for a capable and Affordable artist out there that can tackle
the biz you need, Dood!
╹‿╹)

Word from the wise, it won't be the big names, In terms of commissioning,
they're like luxury brand cars, Rad but super expensive and overkill if your
just looking for something that would take you from point A to B.
You gotta look but trust me, the indies are out there and not only
are they affordable, but you'll be helping out another peep likely
in the same spot. Passing on goodness, Dood~!
◠‿╹)~★

Since it's placeholder art anyway it doesn't need to be "good." It can be amateurish and naive as long as it gets the job done.

Thank you, everyone, for the advice and kind words. I'll pass it all on to him. :)

After a long talk, he decided to remove the placeholder AI art and lower the price to 'pay what you want'.
He's hoping it will take off enough to commission an artist so he can consider it a complete product.

I'll ask here, for any mods/admins to answer: Can I post his link in the off-topic forum? Or is that not allowed? There's no more AI art in it.

fuzzy_kobold said:
I'll ask here, for any mods/admins to answer: Can I post his link in the off-topic forum? Or is that not allowed? There's no more AI art in it.

Good instincts to check first; this would unfortunately violate our rules on advertising.

1.9 Advertising

• Do not promote any external sites, resources, products, or services.
• If you are an artist or content owner, you are permitted to advertise products and services you may offer. You may do so in the "description" field of your posts, on the artist page, and in your profile description.

If you wish to promote your products or services through a banner ad, please contact [email protected] with any questions. See the advertisement help page for more information.

I'd say you're welcome to advertise their work on your profile if you'd like (& if they're on here they definitely can), but not in the forums.

Interesting.
I'm currently in the same situation where I have worked on a project for over 1 year, and I'm very close to completion, however the project is missing the visual aspect.
Although for me it is not related to money. It is instead a project I have worked on because it's what I'm passionate about.

I don't know anything about D&D or what exactly your friend is trying to sell, but it may be worth considering that it's unrealistic to expect the project to come off as a finished "product" without the visuals. Somewhere down the line you have to think about if you can actually finish a certain project with your current skills. I have accepted that I do not possess the skills of a visual designer, so once the backend of my project is fully done, I will outsource by giving creative control to whoever wants to build visuals on my technical work. Worst case scenario is that I will spend years learning visual design to finish the project entirely solo. It is incredibly difficult when you're not a fast learner or have economy to help you get through the month, but ultimately this is how life is, and I've accepted that skills require years of dedicated work to create what you want.

It's possible your friend did not realize that their full vision was unrealistic until they completed the project, which will lead to a mental roadblock because you are suddenly *not in control* of your project. The only way you take back control is understanding that life requires roadblocks, and rethink your options while accepting that your project may be delayed by a long time.

These are my ramblings on this topic because I am in the same boat, but maybe a bit more of an oceanic boat than your friend. The estimated price for the visual parts of my project is about 15k euros. In contrast, it may be realistic for your friend to pay for some art if the amount of art is reasonable. I wish you good luck on figuring things out, and don't give up!

aacafah said:
Good instincts to check first; this would unfortunately violate our rules on advertising.
I'd say you're welcome to advertise their work on your profile if you'd like (& if they're on here they definitely can), but not in the forums.

Thank you for the info.

cadynn said:
Interesting.
I'm currently in the same situation where I have worked on a project for over 1 year, and I'm very close to completion, however the project is missing the visual aspect.
Although for me it is not related to money. It is instead a project I have worked on because it's what I'm passionate about.

I don't know anything about D&D or what exactly your friend is trying to sell, but it may be worth considering that it's unrealistic to expect the project to come off as a finished "product" without the visuals. Somewhere down the line you have to think about if you can actually finish a certain project with your current skills. I have accepted that I do not possess the skills of a visual designer, so once the backend of my project is fully done, I will outsource by giving creative control to whoever wants to build visuals on my technical work. Worst case scenario is that I will spend years learning visual design to finish the project entirely solo. It is incredibly difficult when you're not a fast learner or have economy to help you get through the month, but ultimately this is how life is, and I've accepted that skills require years of dedicated work to create what you want.

It's possible your friend did not realize that their full vision was unrealistic until they completed the project, which will lead to a mental roadblock because you are suddenly *not in control* of your project. The only way you take back control is understanding that life requires roadblocks, and rethink your options while accepting that your project may be delayed by a long time.

These are my ramblings on this topic because I am in the same boat, but maybe a bit more of an oceanic boat than your friend. The estimated price for the visual parts of my project is about 15k euros. In contrast, it may be realistic for your friend to pay for some art if the amount of art is reasonable. I wish you good luck on figuring things out, and don't give up!

I'll avoid saying what it is here, as I feel that skirts a bit too close to advertising, but look in my profile in a few minutes from this post to take a look.