The bulk update request #5249 is active.

change category unseen_male (228) -> invalid
change category unseen_female (30) -> invalid

Reason: If a character is unseen then their gender shouldn't be tagged. Pronouns in dialogue aren't used for gender tagging (except perhaps lore tags). I think aliasing to invalid_tag is better than placing in the invalid category because there's not really anything they could be replaced with.
unseen_character seems like it should be aliased to offscreen_character as well but idk maybe there's an argument for that one to keep existing? What do you guys think there's already a thread for that, topic #24770

EDIT: The bulk update request #5249 (forum #371420) has been rejected by @slyroon.

EDIT: The bulk update request #5249 (forum #371420) has been approved by @slyroon.

Well, actually I guess they could perhaps be aliased to offscreen_character as well, instead of invalidated... hmm

cloudpie said:
Well, actually I guess they could perhaps be aliased to offscreen_character as well, instead of invalidated... hmm

They seem to also sometimes be used for mostly_offscreen_characters. No matter what it's aliased to, it would cause a decent amount of mistagging.

watsit said:
They seem to also sometimes be used for mostly_offscreen_characters. No matter what it's aliased to, it would cause a decent amount of mistagging.

It also gets tagged in comics or where dialogue shows the character offscreen is male or female?

If it's got viable replacements (offscreen_character, mostly_offscreen_character, faceless_character) it should be put in the invalid category or disambiguated (I don't really have any preference at this point, it's pretty much the same thing) rather than aliased to invalid_tag.

invalid_tag is a mess and we need to stop aliasing things to it unless it's truly necessary.

faucet said:
If it's got viable replacements (offscreen_character, mostly_offscreen_character, faceless_character) it should be put in the invalid category or disambiguated (I don't really have any preference at this point, it's pretty much the same thing) rather than aliased to invalid_tag.

invalid_tag is a mess and we need to stop aliasing things to it unless it's truly necessary.

It leads to ironic spam when trying to deal with retagging or cleanup.

faucet said:
If it's got viable replacements (offscreen_character, mostly_offscreen_character, faceless_character) it should be put in the invalid category or disambiguated (I don't really have any preference at this point, it's pretty much the same thing) rather than aliased to invalid_tag.

invalid_tag is a mess and we need to stop aliasing things to it unless it's truly necessary.

Changed to invalid category

cloudpie said:
Changed to invalid category

I'd combine them into a single disambiguation tag in that case, to prevent people from continuing to use them unabated.

watsit said:
I'd combine them into a single disambiguation tag in that case, to prevent people from continuing to use them unabated.

What would this be named? Unseen_(disambiguation)?

cloudpie said:
What would this be named? Unseen_(disambiguation)?

A good question, since the two primary use-cases that it's ambiguous for (a completely unseen character that is assumed male or female, or a visible but partially offscreen character that is male or female) are different enough that there isn't a clear term suggesting what it could be. Perhaps maybe_unseen_character_(disambiguation)?

offscreen_male, offscreen_female, and offscreen_human have the exact same problem.

scth said:
offscreen_male, offscreen_female, and offscreen_human have the exact same problem.

If they cast a shadow that's clearly feminine, masculine or human anybody can tell which one of these would be applicable, so not really.

The bulk update request #5249 (forum #371420) has been approved by @slyroon.