since they don't fall under Tag What You See (at least as far as I know), should crossgender and alternate species (and all the subtags/implications therein) be lore tags?

(edited for clarity)

I agree they should be lore tags, it's completely reliant on outside information (therefore violation TWYS) so it should be a lore tag. It's been discussed a few times I think but I don't think anybody has ever made a BUR to handle it.

I +1 this

faucet said:
I agree they should be lore tags, it's completely reliant on outside information (therefore violation TWYS) so it should be a lore tag. It's been discussed a few times I think but I don't think anybody has ever made a BUR to handle it.

IIRC part of the problem is that they quite literally can't be handled by BURs; an admin needs to manually set the tags.

I agree with this too, and offer an additional lore tag suggestion in anthrofied (and all similar tags), since that too relies on outside knowledge.

moonlit-comet said:
I agree with this too, and offer an additional lore tag suggestion in anthrofied (and all similar tags), since that too relies on outside knowledge.

I believe most of these already imply alternate species, but yes~

strikerman said:
IIRC part of the problem is that they quite literally can't be handled by BURs; an admin needs to manually set the tags.

I just tested it on my own e6 instance and it looks like it actually is possible - it just has to be a two-part BUR. For example:

I might make a BUR later if nobody beats me to it first.

faucet said:
I just tested it on my own e6 instance and it looks like it actually is possible - it just has to be a two-part BUR. For example:

Everything that happens inside a bur is processed in the context of the approving user. Antecedent/Consequent tags are created on approve if they don't already exist, and when an admin hits the button the missing lore tag is being properly created. The same also applies to the category change.

The one I'm really not looking forward to tackling is the nightmare tangle of familial relations tags. The worst part is that we've never had an umbrella tag for when any two characters are related in some way, despite that being an obvious thing to create, so we have to manually hunt down all the applicable tags first.

If I was doing it, step 1 would be repealing topic #3969.

faucet said:
I just tested it on my own e6 instance and it looks like it actually is possible - it just has to be a two-part BUR. For example:

BUR 1

alias crossgender -> crossgender_(lore)

BUR 2

category crossgender_(lore) -> lore

I might make a BUR later if nobody beats me to it first.

oh I didn't know you could BUR categories, thas cool~

any reason not to do both the alias and category in the same BUR? did it just not work or something? I kinda wanna give it a go~

foxxxy64 said:
any reason not to do both the alias and category in the same BUR? did it just not work or something? I kinda wanna give it a go~

Technically you can do it all in one BUR, but changing the category doesn't work unless the tag already exists.

Due to the nature of how BURs work, it's not actually guaranteed to run the commands in the correct order, so it's likely to attempt (and fail) to set the category before the lore tag is actually created.

faucet said:
Technically you can do it all in one BUR, but changing the category doesn't work unless the tag already exists.

Due to the nature of how BURs work, it's not actually guaranteed to run the commands in the correct order, so it's likely to attempt (and fail) to set the category before the lore tag is actually created.

An alias also changes the target tag's category to match the source tag's category, so even if the tag already exists, there would still be a race between the alias changing the target's category and the category command. IIRC, it was mentioned that a warning was placed for moderators that approve BURs to watch out for BURs that do an alias and category change, or which alias certain things, to make sure the category is set properly afterward (there's been a few instances where aliasing invalid artist tags to invalid_tag has resulted in invalid_tag becoming an artist tag).

okay, I tried to input the BUR, but I got two errors and it didn't seem to take. first is I can't create a BUR with more than 25 items, easy enough to fix. the second error, it added a comment to the script (small sample):

alias crossgender -> crossgender_(lore) # duplicate of has blocking transitive relationships, cannot be applied through BUR
alias fti_crossgender -> fti_crossgender_(lore) # duplicate of has blocking transitive relationships, cannot be applied through BUR
alias ftg_crossgender -> ftg_crossgender_(lore) # duplicate of has blocking transitive relationships, cannot be applied through BUR
alias fta_crossgender -> fta_crossgender_(lore) # duplicate of has blocking transitive relationships, cannot be applied through BUR
alias fth_crossgender -> fth_crossgender_(lore) # duplicate of has blocking transitive relationships, cannot be applied through BUR
alias ftmh_crossgender -> ftmh_crossgender_(lore) # duplicate of has blocking transitive relationships, cannot be applied through BUR
alias ftm_crossgender -> ftm_crossgender_(lore) # duplicate of has blocking transitive relationships, cannot be applied through BUR

in case anyone else wants to troubleshoot or attempt on their private instance, the full code is below

alias crossgender -> crossgender_(lore)
alias fti_crossgender -> fti_crossgender_(lore)
alias ftg_crossgender -> ftg_crossgender_(lore)
alias fta_crossgender -> fta_crossgender_(lore)
alias fth_crossgender -> fth_crossgender_(lore)
alias ftmh_crossgender -> ftmh_crossgender_(lore)
alias ftm_crossgender -> ftm_crossgender_(lore)
alias itf_crossgender -> itf_crossgender_(lore)
alias gtf_crossgender -> gtf_crossgender_(lore)
alias atf_crossgender -> atf_crossgender_(lore)
alias htf_crossgender -> htf_crossgender_(lore)
alias mhtf_crossgender -> mhtf_crossgender_(lore)
alias itm_crossgender -> itm_crossgender_(lore)
alias gtm_crossgender -> gtm_crossgender_(lore)
alias atm_crossgender -> atm_crossgender_(lore)
alias htm_crossgender -> htm_crossgender_(lore)
alias mhtm_crossgender -> mhtm_crossgender_(lore)
alias mtf_crossgender -> mtf_crossgender_(lore)
alias mti_crossgender -> mti_crossgender_(lore)
alias mtg_crossgender -> mtg_crossgender_(lore)
alias mta_crossgender -> mta_crossgender_(lore)
alias mth_crossgender -> mth_crossgender_(lore)
alias mtmh_crossgender -> mtmh_crossgender_(lore)
alias mhtf_crossgender -> mhtf_crossgender_(lore)
alias iti_crossgender -> iti_crossgender_(lore)
alias ati_crossgender -> ati_crossgender_(lore)
alias atg_crossgender -> atg_crossgender_(lore)
alias ath_crossgender -> ath_crossgender_(lore)
alias atmh_crossgender -> atmh_crossgender_(lore)
alias gti_crossgender -> gti_crossgender_(lore)
alias gta_crossgender -> gta_crossgender_(lore)
alias gth_crosssgender -> gth_crosssgender_(lore)
alias gtmh_crossgender -> gtmh_crossgender_(lore)
alias hti_crossgender -> hti_crossgender_(lore)
alias hta_crossgender -> hta_crossgender_(lore)
alias htg_crossgender -> htg_crossgender_(lore)
alias htmh_crossgender -> htmh_crossgender_(lore)
alias mhti_crossgender -> mhti_crossgender_(lore)
alias mhta_crossgender -> mhta_crossgender_(lore)
alias mhtg_crossgender -> mhtg_crossgender_(lore)
alias mhth_crossgender -> mhth_crossgender_(lore)
alias itm_crossgender -> itm_crossgender_(lore)
alias alternate_species -> alternate_species_(lore)
alias furrification -> furrification_(lore)
alias humanized -> humanized_(lore)
alias humanoidized -> humanoidized_(lore)
alias anthrofied -> anthrofied_(lore)
alias feralized -> feralized_(lore)

category crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category fti_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category ftg_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category fta_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category fth_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category ftmh_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category ftm_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category itf_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category gtf_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category atf_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category htf_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mhtf_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category itm_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category gtm_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category atm_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category htm_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mhtm_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mtf_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mti_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mtg_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mta_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mth_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mtmh_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mhtf_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category iti_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category ati_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category atg_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category ath_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category atmh_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category gti_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category gta_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category gth_crosssgender_(lore) -> lore
category gtmh_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category hti_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category hta_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category htg_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category htmh_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mhti_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mhta_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mhtg_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category mhth_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category itm_crossgender_(lore) -> lore
category alternate_species_(lore) -> lore
category furrification_(lore) -> lore
category humanized_(lore) -> lore
category humanoidized_(lore) -> lore
category anthrofied_(lore) -> lore
category feralized_(lore) -> lore

also, for "forum topic", I should put the id number for this thread?

foxxxy64 said:
okay, I tried to input the BUR, but I got two errors and it didn't seem to take. first is I can't create a BUR with more than 25 items, easy enough to fix. the second error, it added a comment to the script (small sample):

You need to remove the existing aliases and implications on the crossgender tags, then do the aliases to lore, and recreate the previous aliases and implications with the lore tags.

watsit said:
You need to remove the existing aliases and implications on the crossgender tags, then do the aliases to lore, and recreate the previous aliases and implications with the lore tags.

that's what I was afraid of...each crossgender tag has about 4 aliases...

this is much bigger than I expected, lol...maybe this is why nobodys done it yet 😅